Answer the following questions, then respond as usual.
1. Cite a place in place where you see the notion of the cyclical pattern of family, that is, the idea that the sins and virtues of one generation are played out again in the next. How powerful is this pattern, and is there any real hope to break free of it?
2. What is significant about the occupations or situations of the members of Troy's family in the final scene of the play?
3. To what extent is Troy wrong about how American society has changed during his lifetime? To what extent is he right?
4. Troy talks a great deal about the important of independence and self-reliance, but he is also a user and manipulator of others. Does this make him a liar? self-deceptive? something else?
5. Towards the end of the play, what is the significance of Cory singing the song “Old Blue” that Troy sang earlier in the play?- What happens to Gabe at the end of the play?
2. What is significant about the occupations or situations of the members of Troy's family in the final scene of the play?
3. To what extent is Troy wrong about how American society has changed during his lifetime? To what extent is he right?
4. Troy talks a great deal about the important of independence and self-reliance, but he is also a user and manipulator of others. Does this make him a liar? self-deceptive? something else?
5. Towards the end of the play, what is the significance of Cory singing the song “Old Blue” that Troy sang earlier in the play?- What happens to Gabe at the end of the play?
20 comments:
1. Cory is not allowed to play football because of his father. there is little hope to break it because Troy is determined to destroy himself and his family.
2. Cory is now a Marine, a "man's" career, where he could have been a football player.
3. He is right that society has changed enough that he is allowed to drive the truck. however, he is wrong because society had yet to permit him to have a license or to read.
4. He is deceiving himself into thinking he is an independent person, while he used his brother's money to build his house.
5. This convinces him to go to the funeral. He tries to open the gates of heaven with his horn, and then performs a traditional African dance.
Title: Fences
Author: August Wilson was born in 1945. Fences was his second play to make Broadway. He won a Pulitzer prize in 1987. Wilson died in 2005.
Basic Passage: Bono:
Been fighting with them people about driving and ain't even got a license. Mr. Rand know you ain't got no driver's license?
Correlation: Oftentimes, it seems that people fight the wrong battles. Was it wrong for Troy to want to drive? Of course not, but perhaps the battle he should have been waging is against his not having a driver's license. The play isn't clear if his lack of a license is due to other's discrimination, on or off the books, or due to his inabilities. Whatever the situation, Troy should be fighting whatever is keeping him from having the license. Fighting the wrong battles eventually causes all kinds of hardships in the family.
Cause of tragedy: Troy sabatoges both himself and his family.
Change to comedy: If Troy and his family could break the cycle of self-destruction.
Questions 1 & 2 are answered in my comment.
3. Troy is right in that society has "advanced" enough that he is allowed to drive the garbage truck but he is wrong in that he still doesn't have rights that equal a white man's.
4.Troy is a hypocrite because he used Gabriel's money to pay for the majority of his house. He is not independent in that he allows his life to become so entwined in Rose's that he loses himself & does nothing to stop it.
5.Raynell & Cory singing "Old Blue" shows the bringing together of the "old" Troy - bad father/husband to Cory/Rose - & the "new" Troy - uninvolved father/husband that no longer causes the same damage he did to Cory, Lyons, & Rose.
Gabriel tries to open the Gates of Heaven for Troy with a broken trumpet. When this doesn't work, he resorts to doing an African dance & moaning.
Title: I am my father's son
Intro to Author: August Wilson (1945-2005) was born Frederick August Kittel, Jr. in Pittsburg, Pennsylvania to a German-born baker & an African-American woman. His father was both emotionally & financially unsupportive of their family. After his mother remarried, the family moved, & Wilson attended a mostly white high school. Here he was accused of plagiarism due to the caliber of his work, & eventually dropped out. August Wilson then educated himself by reading anything & everything he could get his hands on. He was a major player in American drama in the late 20th & early 21st centuries. August Wilson was a talented playwright, winning several awards including two Pulitzer Prizes for Drama.
Basic Passage: "You got to take the crookeds with the straights. That's what Papa used to say."
Correlation: This statement could have two different meanings, depending on your viewpoint: you have to take the bad things in life with the good or every good situation has a negative counterpart.
During the conversation between Lyons & Cory from which this quote comes, it appears Lyons has done exactly what Troy warned him about in the beginning of the play & has truely become his father's son. Troy's warning to become self-reliant went unheeded by Lyons as evident by his being put in jail for cashing other peolpe's checks. After losing Bonnie & being incarcerated, hefinally sees his life from his father's perspective. It is at this moment that Lyons realizes he's been unable to fulfill his dreams & hold on to what means most to him - just like Troy. Troy's "crookeds" being the loss of Alberta, Rose, Gabriel, & Cory, as well as not being able to make a living playing ball, his broken relationship with his own father, & his time spent in jail. Essentially, this statement sums up Troy's negative philosophy on life & illustrates the impact it had on his & his family's lives.
Tragedy: Troy's actions & ideals end up isolating him from the people he loves & is trying to help.
Comedy: While everyone believed Gabriel to be crazy, he was the only one that seemed to understand what was going to happen.
Difficultes: None
Response to Brett's post:
I think the fact that Troy doesn't have/is unable to get a license isn't really the point to the play. The repetition of mistakes, misdirected love/poorly executed concern, self-realization, & self-motivation are underlying themes in the play.
1. Answered in comment
2. The family is still following the self destructing cycles.
3. Troy thinks that society hasn't changed from when he grew up. He's wrong because it has changed and his son has an opportunity to get a scholarship to college where as when he was growing he wouldn't have.
4. I think Troy is a liar because he uses Gabe's money to pay for his house. But yet he tells everyone that you should be selfreliant.
5. I think it's helping him prepare for the funeral. Gabe tries to open the gates of heaven.
Title: "Fences"
Author: August Wilson
Wilson was born Frederick August Kittel, Jr. in 1945. He has won numerous awards. His plays are realistic dramas that focus on the difficulties of African American life.
Basic Passage: Lyons: I ain't asked you to give me nothing. I asked you to loan me ten dollars. I know you got ten dollars. Troy: Yeah, I got it. You know why I got it? Cause I don't throw my money away out there in the street...I done spent too many years without.
Correlation: Troy wants Lyons to learn from his mistakes and not to depend on him for money. He wants Lyons to get a job instead of being a musician. I can relate to this because people don't need to depend on parents forever, they need to get out in the world and be able to support themselves.
Difficulties: none
Tragedy: Troy and family keep repeating cycles that hurt the family.
I am commenting on CMH503's post. A lot of times today many kids don't leave home until their in their 20's sometimes even later. Not that way for me. I'm 20 and I already live on my own. Its sad that some people can't fend for themselves at that age.
1. Troy's father does not allow him to play football and be successful and receive a scholarship. Corey's father thinks "everything passes through yourself".
2. One situation that I think is significant is the fact that Troy and his father got into a fight and his father made him leave home. Troy and his son also got into a fight.
3. Troy is right that the society has changed in some ways, but he's still not receiving every right in America.
4. Troy is deceiving because he talks about self- reliance and living on your own but he still borrows money from his father.
5. Gabe tries to open the gates of heaven.
Title: "Fences" by August Wilson
Intro: Wilson was born in 1945. He has been known during the past two decades for his extrememly popular drama. His plays focus on the reality of the difficulty of African American life in the 20th century. Wilson died in 2005.
Passage: "They got alot of colored baseball players now."
Correlation: This statement stands out to me, because we discussed this topic in class the other day. It shows that the play recognizes that society has changed and is allowing people of other races to participate in sports, but Troy's father still does not allow him to become successful this way. Troy's father thinks you must work for your success and he believes "everything passes through yourself".
I am commenting on musicman's comment. Yes i do understand that some people can live on their own at a young age, but others can not. For instance, my situation is completely different. I go to radiology school full- time, and with all the studying I do not have time to get a full-time job and live out on my own. So I will still rely on my parents until I get out of college.
Title: got to live too
Author: August Wilson was born in 1945 as Frederick August Kittel, Jr. in Pittsburg. His fatehr was a German and his mom was black. He won a Pulitzer prize in 1987. he died in 2005.
basic Passage:
yeah i got to eat but ive got to live too.
Correvlation
Some times there are more important things in life than jsut eating. i mwean eating is important but u know haviong fun is important. If u dont eat for a really long time your body might die. But what if u dont have fun or "live", your souil might die. you might become a shell of a person. You can get so caught up in doing chores and and errands and such "eating" that you forget to have fun- enjoy your life ...go to the beach and such ...just "live".
Tradegy: he isnt eating well.
Comedy: he is living well
difficulties: none
it has been addressed that troy is a hypocritye because he tells others to be self relient yet he doesnt practice waht he preaches so to speak. Maybe troy harps on self reliance so much because he really wishes that he could become self relient. its kind of like why people with mental problems become psychologists or some thing like that
Author: August Wilson was born Frederick August Kittel in 1945, in Pittsburgh, PA. He was the son of Frederick August (a baker) and Daisy (a cleaning woman. He cofounded andwas the director of Black Horizons on the Hill, theatre company in Pittsburgh, PA.
Basic Passage: "I ain't got no extra money. Gabe done moved over to Miss Pearl's paying her the rent and things done got tight around here. I can't afford to give you every payday," says Troy. Lyons, "I ain't asked you to give me nothing. I asked you to loan me ten dollars. I know you got te dollars." Troy says, "Yeah I got it. You know why I got it? Cause I don't throw my money away out there in the streets. You living the fast life...wanna be a musician...running around in them clubs and things...then, you learn to take care of yourself. You ain't gonna find me going and asking nobody for nothing. I done spent too many years without."
Correlate: This is a pattern for Lyons as he continually begs for money throughout the play. He always manages to get it somehow. This pattern will not easily be broken. His dad tries to discourage him from begging for money and wants him to not be a musician but get a job and succeed in life.
Difficulties: I did not have any.
Tragedy: The tragedy is thatTroy feels that society is not fair and struggles with this idea.
1. Answered in comment.
2. Cory has become a Marine Corporal in the U.S. Marine Corp. At Troy's funeral Lyon's ends up being just like his father and is put in jail for cashing other people's checks. He has become what his father warned him he would be.
But Cory has made a better life by joining the Marines.
3. Troy believes that times have changed dramatically and society has become poorer and more people have become homeless. What he doesn't understand is that society is really changing for the better and trying to eliminate poverty.
4. Troy begs for money from Lyons after his payday loans and normally gets ten dollars. Troy is a user and is deceiving himself. He makes a liar of himself. This is wrong by most people's standards today, unless you are willing to pay someone back.
5. Cory is singing about the dog named Blue because he reminisces about a time when his papa, Troy, sang the song to him. Gabriel sings this song as a reminder of Troy after his death and wishes him farewell.
Questions:
1) The cyclical patterns of family are displayed when Troy and Cory get in a physical as well as emotional struggle just as Troy had with his father. These patterns are powerful because children often learn by example and Troy became how he was partly through observing his own father. The cycle can be changed as displayed with Cory and his attempt to better his life by joining the Marines.
2) All three children are left without a father. Cory and Lyons do not have a high opinion of their father where as Raynell experienced a different relationship than they had with Troy. Cory and Lyons differ in that Lyons never really had Troy in his life. This may contribute to fact that Lyons was not able to learn from Troy's mistakes and now is in trouble for cashing checks illegally.
3) Society has progressed somewhat but their still was not complete equality.
4) He is in denial if he thinks himself to be independent when he used Gabriel's checks to gain everything he has.
5)The song convinces Cory to forgive Troy because he sees what lessons he has taught his children. At the end Gabe has a painful realization.
Title: "History always repeats itself."
Basic Passage:
"Death ain't nothing but a fastball on the outside corner."
Correlation:
This displays how Troy views himself as immortal and feels nothing can harm him. This passage is at the beginning of the play as if to establish his character. Even though he no longer plays baseball he still wants to live in the glory of those days. Also, when a character in a drama views themselves as invincible, it is a setup for tragedy. Anybody can relate to this. Usually in our younger years we can have the feeling that we are capable of acheiving anything and think that nothing will happen to us.
Tragedy: Troy dies on bad terms with his family.
Difficulties: None
I aggree with Maggalay's correlation. I believe both the interpretations of that quote can be correct. I also believe that you can learn from mistakes you've made in the past and make yourself a better person.
I am commenting on Maggaly0326 response. She is completely right you have to take the good with the bad in life. Sometimes everything in life is great but there are times when everything that could go wrong will go wrong. To even get back to the good you have to suffer through the bad. I'm reminded of the bible story of Job. He was a great man of faith and he had anything you could think of. All of a sudden though the devil thought he would tempt him to get him to curse God's name. After everything that he owned was gone he was still praising God, and of course God blessed him then.
1. When Lyons asks Troy for money. When Lynons wants to play footballand Troy won't let him, because he wasn't allowed to.
2. Cory is a Marine. He made something of his life. Where as, Lyons ends up being the man that his father warned him about. He ends up in jail.
3. I think that Troy is upset, because when he wanted to play sports he wasn't allowed to. But he was good enough. Now they want his sont to play. He thinks that it is unfair.
4. I think that Troy is a liar, because he borrows money fron his family. But at the same time he won't give his own son some money to live on.
5. Gabe tries to open the gates of heaven.
Title: "Fences"
Author: August Wilson
Wison was born Frederick Auguse Kittle, Jr.. He was born in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. He used his birth place for many of his setting for his plays. Wilson was one of only seven American authors to win two Pulitzer Prizes for Drama.
Basic Passage:Lyons: I ain't asked you to give me nothing. I asked you to loan me ten dolloars. I know you got ten dollars.
Correlation: I can relate to this passage, because when I ask my parents for money they won't give me anything. They always say that I have a job and I should have enough money. But sometimes I just don't have enough to make it til next payday, and they don't understand.
Difficulties: I had none.
Tragedy: That hte family keeps repaeating their mistakes.
Comedy: That the family could find happiness in the society that they live in.
i agree with creole's post. One should not be satisfied with simply surviving, especially in the US. There are many people in many different countries that do not have opportunities that we are afforded here. These opportunities should not cause us to get caught up in jobs as many people do. We should be aware of a need to relax and live a little bit.
August Wilson
Title:"Fences"
Author:
Wilson was born in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. He has won numerous New York Drama Critics Circle Awards, American Theatre Critics' Association Award, and Tony Awards, and also awarded the Bush and Guggenheim Fellowships. His plays is based on the difficulties of African-American life in the 20th century and most of his play's settings was Pittsburgh. He died in October 2005, and two weeks after they renamed the Virginia Theatre the August Wilson Theatre.
Basic Passage:
"Death ain't nothing. I done seen him. Done wrassled with him. You can't tell me nothing about death."
Correlation:
This means to me is that it confirms Troy's personaltiy. He was already lived and thinks he can overcome anything. Which if I have battled death, I would probably be the same way, absoultely nothing can hold me back.
Tragedy:
Troy's relationship with his family
Comedy:
If Troy and his family's relationship would change.
Diff:
None
1.Cory is not allowed to play football because of Troy.
2.Cory is a marine, and made something out of his life where Lyon is arrested at the end and has become what Troy warned about.
3.Society has changed but they still don't fully get treated like everyone else.
4. I think it is self-deceptive. He thinks that he is independent in his eyes, but others can see how it really is.
5.It makes him go to the funeral. He tries to open the gates into heaven but fails, so he does an African dance and it works. Being true to himself open the gates of heaven.
I agree with Brett's comment. You should fight for whatever it is that is holding you back from your dream or goal in life. That is what Troy should have done.
Author: August Wilson
August Wilson was born in 1945 in Pittsburg Pennsylvania to Fredrik August German immigrant and Daisy Wilson an African American. He was raised in a poor neighborhood most of his young life but in his teens moved with his mother and step father to a middleclass neighborhood where he attended school. After being accused of plagiarism August dropped out of school and educated himself by spending most of his time in a library. He is one of only two people to ever win two Pulitzer Prizes.
Basic Passage: Don't worry about whether some one like you; worry about whether they doin right by you.
This passage is something we should all live by. It doesn't matter if people like you especially if you are yourself. What matters if people treat you right, or with respect? No matter what walk of life people come from we are all still human, there shouldn't be fences between us especially because of color or financial status. This play is based on the fences that people build around them selves and one another, not only to keep things out but to keep them in as well. Everyone needs the opportunity to make their way in the world, and in this play Troy doesn't give himself or his family the freedom to do either. He not only denies himself the opportunity to live, which eventually leads to trouble, but he also tries to control his children’s life. By not being more open to the possibility that his children may not make the same mistakes he did, Troy is essentially smothering his children and eventually pushes them away. This is a mistake he make with Cori for sure, but doesn't realize it until Cori is already gone.
I didn't have any difficulties
This is a tragedy, because Troy losses a connection with one of his son's and betrays his wife all because he builds barriers around himself.
1. There are cyclical patterns with Troy and his Father which is seem in Troy's anger issues, such as his abusiveness toward Cori, and with his constant belittlement of Lyons. There is also a cyclical patters with Lyon's criminal activity. He follows in the foot steps of Troy who has been to Prison. Yes there is hope of breaking this pattern, we see this with Cori, who goes on to make something of himself by joining the military.
2. In the final scene of the play Cori comes home from the Military. He has made something of himself, something his father didn't think was possible. Lyons is just out of prison, he in a sense paid for his fathers sins by being his fathers son and following in his footsteps. It seems that the severance of the connection between Cori and his father has enabled him to shake the shadow and become something more than Troy was.
3. Troy saw the change in society when he was able to have his own home. As a child he has seen blacks living in shacks made of sticks and tar paper, and now he has a real home, however; he is still in a menial job doing manual labor and thinks that society doesn’t give him the same opportunities as the white man.
4. Troy talks about independence, but he depends on his wife for love and support and more importantly he depends on his brother’s money to have a home of his own. I think this makes him a hypocrite.
5. In the end of the play Cori sings the song about old blue with Ryanel. This song is the only thigh that connects them to each other and their father. This is the one good thing Cori can hold on to. Gabe in the end comes to a realization that he is not the arch angle Gabriel that he thought he was. He blows on the horn and nothing happens, this as the play say would e devastating to a sane person, but Gabe reaches down to his primal self and by being who he truly is, is able to open the gates of Heaven.
Comment on Brooks comment.
There are plenty of young people that live on their own no matter what their situation. It depends on the circummstances under which you leave. You go to school full time, and you live at home and are lucky enough to have that help avaiale to you. There are so many that do not. Its just a matter of doing what is not only best for you but for those that depend on you. In the play Cori leaves home not of his own accord as much as he is forced out by his father. This ends up being a good thing for hi beause he is ale to shake his fathers shaodow and become his own man. So even though it was hard for him Cori leaving home was probably the best thing he ccould have done even though he had no way of taking care of himself. He found a way.
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